WULF: OK, it's 13 degrees (farenheit), and (Grym Kym) wants to go outside for a cigarrette.
GRYM KYM: Well, I'd like to see the stars, actually, because, to be honest with you, that's a fair argument...
(We were listening to black metal, after all...)
WULF: OK, well let's go see the stars...I'm not gonna lose a metal argument here, to Grym Kym...
(to our audience) Even though you know what? You know what really sucks? Grym Kym doesn't know this right now,
but this is Grym Kym (G-R-Y-MK-Y-M), (and) she's unaware of the existence of Grim Kim Kelly, who is (already) a famous metal writer-
|Grim Kim Kelly, NOT Grym Kym|
WULF: Her name is Kim Kelly...
GRYM KYM: I guess my dreams are completely dashed now.
WULF: Well, you can spell yours with a "y", the only problem though is that it wouldn't make a difference except (Grim)
Kim Kelly posted a comment on the Malicious Intent website to Judge Dredd's post in which he linked an article
that she wrote.
GRYM KYM: Which one?
WULF: I don't remember.
GRYM KYM: I read a couple of them...a couple of Judge Dredd's.
WULF: Yeah, I don't remember.
GRYM KYM: It seems like he was really kind of taking the reins there...
WULF: Yeah, no definitely. Well, the thing is, the biggest problem I think I have is as far as productivity goes is that
whenever I have a lot of free time, I'm not very productive. Whenever I'm really busy, I'm very productive.
GRYM KYM: Actually, to be honest with you, I think you actually do a pretty good job. Coming from somebody
who's not productive at all-
WULF: A good job of what?
GRYM KYM: Being productive! On a semi-regular basis, I think you do a very good job.
WULF: Well, that's very sweet Grym Kym, thank you.
GRYM KYM: I wasn't trying to be sweet.
WULF: Well, you know, you're a sweet person. But anyway, OK, I just want to say, for those who are listening-
GRYM KYM: Oh, I forgot about-
WULF: Yeah, we're recording! For those who are listening, Grym Kym and I are out in the middle of-
GRYM KYM: Well, who are you? You haven't introduced yourself.
WULF: I'm Wulf. We are in the middle of like, really fucking cold weather.
GRYM KYM: Only 13 degrees.
1. "The Funeral Wind Born in Oriana" - Nokturnal Mortum
|"Nechrist"-era Nokturnal Mortum|
and the moon and farmhouses and Grym Kym just heard Nokturnal Mortum's "Nechrist" for the first time...not the album,
just the first track. I was explaining to her, about how...they were obviously really into the Ukraine (being) their homeland and (that) they incorporate a lot of folk elements or whatever... ...Grym Kym, what do you have to say?
GRYM KYM: I was just going to say, I thought you wanted my opinion on it, but you're going into the history of it,
and that's fine.
WULF: Well yeah, but that all leads up to-
|Knjaz Varggoth back in the dizay|
GRYM KYM: The singer...I thought he sounded really upset.
WULF: Knjaz Varggoth is his name.
GRYM KYM: I also felt like he probably experienced maybe extreme, cold winters but also I feel like the string
folk section sounded a lot like Korpiklaani, and tell me I'm crazy for that, but it sounded a little gypsy-ish,
you know? And that's my intelligent contribution to this metal discussion-
WULF: Well here's the thing, I know that you are well-versed in folk (metal), but maybe not the (black/folk metal)
GRYM KYM: Well that was actually kind of a new combo for me. That actually made me laugh a lot.
WULF: OK, well what I want to ask you is, what do you think of the whole onslaught of the sound though?
GRYM KYM: The onslaught of the sound?
WULF: Yeah, like when that first came on-
GRYM KYM: OK, I got a little excited.
WULF: But you were like, OK, this is too much, I can't handle this, and you changed the track, and I was like,
no, you gotta wait for like, the shit to come-
GRYM KYM: OK, fair. For the stuff that I actually enjoy listening to I would say that for like, pure black metal,
I care for symphonic, and apparently, I care for folk a little bit, I give it, maybe, a 5 out of 10, maybe even
a 6, a little bit-
WULF: But don't you think they make up for it, though, in like, enthusiasm? And what I think what really does it for
|Old pic of Munruthel|
GRYM KYM: Munruthel?
WULF: The drumming. The drumming is so frantic! And is so intense and so urgent, you know what
I mean? It's so like, "you need to listen to this".
GRYM KYM: I did feel that, when it was the screaming, kind of your basic black metal, and the folk came in, and it hit you, and you were like "whoa", like, this is getting a little weird at this point, and then yes the drums, you know, with that, as well, and then the onslaught of the sound, I would say, will surprise you.
WULF: But did it make you kind of like, want to do a little jig? Made you kind of want to dance around?
GRYM KYM: Well, yeah. Anytime I hear something like that, I kind of want to dance a little bit, BUT at the same time I'm thinking, 'well I'm listening to a bunch of nazis and they're really upset because they
sound so upset you know...
WULF: Do you think they're OK?
GRYM KYM: No.
WULF: You don't think they're OK?
GRYM KYM: No.
WULF: I'm sorry.
GRYM KYM: Well it was your topic.
WULF: Well that was Grym Kym's judgement of the first track off of "Nechrist" (A Funeral Wind Born in Oriana") by Nokturnal Mortum, and we're going to continue.
2. "Moon Shrouded in Misery, Part 1" - Xasthur
OK, so we just listened to the second track off of the Xasthur (demo) "A Gate Through Bloodstained Mirrors", but Grym Kym, what do you think of Xasthur?
GRYM KYM: Of Xasthur, or his music?
WULF: The music!
GRYM KYM: The music itself?
WULF: You just told me you had a whole story-
GRYM KYM: Sure, but you just asked what I thought of Xasthur.
WULF: OK, OK, but what's the story that you have in your head (while you were) closing your eyes and listening to it for a little while.
GRYM KYM: OK, well this is just something that came to me. (As) I shut my eyes and I listened to Xasthur and his opus, I felt like I was creeping through a castle, that had, like, water dripping from the ceiling, and most of the stairs were crumbled away, and it was a spiral (staircase) up the tower so you had to really get close to the walls while you were creeping up and be careful not to step on any crumbling stairs. I felt like I got up to the top of the tower, and I don't think it was really me, it was probably someone else. Maybe Xasthur himself.
|Malefic right before he told a real knee-slapper|
GRYM KYM: Whatever.
So he walks through this doorway, nothing special about it, and there's like this billowing, purple curtain. And he stands there for a moment because he can't decide, should he get it over with and open the curtain? Or should he flee? Because there's this horrible dread in his stomach. And the curtain is billowing, there's obviously a draft coming through. And he just like, pulls the curtain away, to reveal a very dark room with high ceilings. It's the top of the tower. And everything's OK, he sees like a chair, a makeshift throne in the center of the room with candles on either side. There's nobody in the chair. But then his eyes kind of adjust to the darkness and he sees all of his companions impaled and dead on spikes (that) encircle the room. And the candlelight is flickering on their corpses. And he's pissed off about it! And that's about as far as I got.
WULF: OK. Well, I think that's good enough so far, obviously the whole album is a journey. The album was called-
GRYM KYM: "Xasthur's Fun Times."
WULF: "A Gate Through Bloodstained Mirrors". So I think that kind of matches up! I think this is very productive so far.
We're going to continue.
3. "Ashen Cold" - Summoning
WULF: OK, well personal things aside, we just listened to (the album) "Let Mortal Heroes Sing Your Fame" by Summoning.
(Grym Kym laughs)
OK, I just told you that it was funny-
GRYM KYM: I know, no, it's funny to say that-
WULF: OK, now it's funny?!
GRYM KYM: No, it's funny to have an interview where you go "alright, well we've been gone for awhile, but, uh, personal things aside...
WULF: Yeah! It's funny!! But no, you laughed when I said-
GRYM KYM: But it's not funny to cry to an Austrian metal band. It's not funny! I didn't cry for the record. At all.
WULF: OK, yeah, but the thing is-
GRYM KYM: OK, I cried the whole time.
WULF: OK, but all personal things aside you did laugh when I told you the album name, which was "Let Mortal Heroes Sing Your Fame", by Summoning.
GRYM KYM: Eh...I didn't laugh that much.
WULF: Well you laughed a little bit. I played the first track, and it was OK, but-
GRYM KYM: No, the first track was awesome.
WULF: OK, well that's good, but the track that things got a little emotional (for)-
GRYM KYM: For (Wulf)...
Wulf got really emotional.
WULF: Yeah, but it was the track "Ashen Cold" which is my favorite track, that I played for Grym Kym. OK, so, personal things aside, what did you think of that track? What did you like?
GRYM KYM: That track had a little bit of everything. It had a little bit of mystery...I wish I could go into details, I wish I could talk about it while it was happening because I can't remember it that well. I know it had a lot of...well, it was mostly uplifting, the tune and the melody of the song was very uplifting. But then I felt like once the vocals came in it got a little confused. As well as being an uplifting song, I feel like perhaps the vocals were not as high-spirited as the melody. But that is what's great about a lot of oldies songs, because they always have really depressing lyrics to really uplifting beats.
Well that's one thing to say, however-
GRYM KYM: But I don't know what they were saying.
WULF: But don't you think though that as far as the melody goes and matching the "Lord of the Rings" kind of theme, don't you think like it could have been like...an orc singing?
GRYM KYM: Oh! Well I've heard orcs singing before and-
WULF: Yeah, but the harsh vocals-
GRYM KYM: I didn't take (orcs) for singers but that's fine-
WULF: Well one reason why I think harsh vocals mesh well with being (in this style of music) is because I kind of sense it's like, channeling this like, "old world" kind of (feeling) or atmosphere of, like, a creature, or this really crazy warrior or barbarian...but that's why sometimes those vocals don't work well with me when bands are trying to be taken more seriously. Like, bands like Opeth or Enslaved, where they're like critically acclaimed and it's like, bordering on serious musicianship as far as like, comparing them to bands like Pink Floyd or something. But then the harsh vocals come in and-
GRYM KYM: In a way to be more metal, or to keep up with the times, or why do they do it?
WULF: Well, I think they have the harsh vocals because it's still extreme music, but when it comes to bands like Opeth and Enslaved, it's like because it's like they're still trying...or not necessarily trying...or maybe they are trying?...to, like, continue that sort of sound but they want to be taken seriously as far as musicians, as far as "The Greats" go and shit. It's just weird for those bands that are really serious musicians that are bordering on, like, crossing (into) the mainstream...that's why Opeth, on their latest album, they just ditched harsh vocals.
GRYM KYM: And then what happened?
WULF: They pretty much just ditched metal.
GRYM KYM: Well how did that work for them? Did it work out?
GRYM KYM: So what do they have if they're not metal? Are they easy-listening?
WULF: No, just a rock band.
GRYM KYM: Oh, a rock band...
WULF: Yeah...but not rock like Clutch or like Witchcraft or something like that, you know what I mean? Witchcraft are somehow still considered a metal band, or a quasi/proto metal (band) or whatever.
|brb, submitting The Black Keys to metal-archives.com|
WULF: Yeah, they're doom-ey, but like-
GRYM KYM: They sound like a garage rock band.
WULF: Yeah! They're not like, really metal, they're kind of-
GRYM KYM: They do sound more like The Black Keys than they sound like, you know, Celtic Frost or something.
WULF: Yeah right! But I think there are bands like, for example, like...OK..name a metal band.
GRYM KYM: Blind Guardian.
WULF: OK, Blind Guardian, right? Blind Guardian don't even use harsh vocals, right? But like, what would it take for Blind Guardian to become, like, acclaimed to the point where you would bring them up to people that are really serious about good rock music and are way into the great guitarists of bands and all that shit, and are like "yeah, I'm really into Led Zeppelin and Pink Floyd", or even new guitarists like Jack White (of The White Stripes), and all that shit.
GRYM KYM: He's good.
WULF: Yeah I know! He's a really good guitarist, right?
GRYM KYM: He's a good singer too.
|Obviously better than Jack White just by looking at him|
GRYM KYM: That would never happen!!
So Opeth thinks that's going to happen for them?
WULF: Well no, but here's the thing, it's like, yeah, we laugh, but metal fans would be like, "oh yeah, like, the Blind Guardian guitarists are way, way better than Jack White. Obviously." You know? Or maybe not, maybe we're selling metal fans short...or maybe I am.
GRYM KYM: But it's completely different! I mean, it's a different art(form) altogether, I think. It's hard to compare two completely different genres like that.
WULF: Yeah that's true. You're right. But, as a metal fan, I'll even put myself out there and say that I feel like if you look at mainstream stuff, as far as like, Rolling Stone's, top 100 guitarists of all time, or 400, or whatever, the latest issue was, top 200 guitarists of all time, you're not going to have a lot of metal guys.
GRYM KYM: But then if you did a metal-specific one it would be completely different. Well if you did any genre-specific (list) I'm sure-
WULF: But that book that you got me-
GRYM KYM: Was it good?
WULF: The Blind Guardian guitarists were on there. Yeah, it was great! It was really good! I was very happy with it. But, it's metal guitarists.
GRYM KYM: Are you saying, perhaps, that metal guitarists get overlooked as far as skill goes because of the genre that they're playing? Like, these guys can be 10x better than Santana and not get any recognition because of the genre that they're playing? Because they can shred, like, insanely shred, and then you have Carlos Santana playing lame-ass shit with Matchbox 20, but he's good at his solos-
WULF: Yeah, definitely.
GRYM KYM: And then the guys in Dream Theater...
I'm just kidding, I just hate them. 20-minute solos...do you think they're neckbeards?
WULF: I don't know, whatever. But what I want to say is that Mikael Akerfeldt, as great a guitarist as he is, or John Petrucci, or whatever, or maybe I'm overstepping with John Petrucci, but Mikael Akerfeldt or the Blind Guardian guitarists, as good as they are, or whoever-
GRYM KYM: But they don't get recognized in the mainstream.
WULF: Great, like, metal guitarists are a lot of times...by great, I don't mean like "mainstream great" like Dave Mustaine or somebody, but like, I don't know, Blind Guardian or whoever, like, fucking Mikael Akerfeldt at least right now would probably not get into those lists even though he's a great guitarist, but that's why I feel like those bands like Enslaved or (whoever) are really trying to almost, may not even consciously do it, but-
GRYM KYM: Break out of the genre confines?
WULF: Yeah, unconsciously trying to legitimize themselves, or maybe they're just even sick of metal, or whatever.
GRYM KYM: I hear what you're saying.
WULF: But it's unconsciously being like, we're good musicians and trying...I shouldn't say trying, but you know (what I mean).
GRYM: Like compare any guy who can do double bass to Ringo Starr.
WULF: Yes!! That's a great example!
(EDIT: This may or may not be real, but if it is it then it makes Ringo slightly more metal...although I don't think he'd be cut out to drum for Fleshgod Apocalypse anytime soon.)
GRYM KYM: I know, I get what you're saying, I do.
WULF: If Rolling Stone did the top 300 drummers of all time, like, Dave Lombardo of Slayer would probably be on there, but compared to modern drummers now, Dave Lombardo, like...he's influential to them, (there are) guys (who) could wayyy kick his ass as far as really crazy, insane drumming (goes), but they're not going to get recognized.
GRYM KYM: Because they're playing metal.
WULF: Because they're playing metal! I think that is a very good argument.
GRYM: No, I agree with you, I'm not arguing.
WULF: No, I'm not saying you're arguing with me, I'm saying we're both arguing that that's a great point. That's a very great point. But that's why I think those bands are doing that, consciously or unconsciously. Anyway, we'll continue on, that was a great Summoning debate, there.
GRYM KYM: All personal things aside.
WULF: We'll continue on with maybe one more.
4. "The Shining" - Anorexia Nervosa
WULF: OK, we just listened to Anorexia Nervosa's last (full-length) album before they went on an indefinite hiatus, "The Redemption Process" I believe. We just listened to the first track, and we listened to a little bit to the intro and then, like, the first 45 seconds after that, of "Sister September". So, Grym Kym, what did you think?
GRYM KYM: Well, I hate to admit it, but as of late I've been listening to a lot of The Black Keys, and listening to Pandora (and) kind of hipster-ey music lately, and I've gotten to hear a lot of songs that I haven't heard before, and kind of exploring that branch, that genre of music a little bit, but I have to say, out of all the music that I've listened to in the last, you know, pretty long time, that band just now was the most enjoyment I've gotten out of listening to music-
WULF: Yeah, see-
GRYM KYM: If that makes any sense, there's this element to their music that I've heard in other symphonic black metal bands, and I don't know which instrument it is, the synthesizer, but certain melodies just sound like you're in a castle...does that make sense at all? There's the haunting, like, pipes, or whatever...it's very medieval-sounding and creepy and...energizing, and I would have to say that I would even classify that as kind of like, castle metal.
|Grym Kym at one point asked me if I thought|
they left their wigs on when they had sex...
It remains a mystery to us to this day.
GRYM KYM: That sounds really fun.
WULF: The orchestra and all that stuff reminds me of it, but the violence of the music of the French Revolution so I think of like, the guillotine and really violent mobs rising up against the royalty and the decadence. But at the same time I also think of simply the decadence. You know what I mean? Like, the decadence of the royalty and I don't know, massive feasts and orgies and-
GRYM KYM: That's not what I was thinking of.
WULF: Well that's what I think of. But not like, happiness, like-
GRYM KYM: Denial?
WULF: Well, I don't know, yeah, maybe. But just decadence and (the) very kind of nihilistic attitude of that whole era, I suppose, in France.
GRYM KYM: OK, well I just thought it was great castle metal, so that's all I'm gonna say. I really enjoyed it, and I did see the similarity to Cradle of Filth, but I felt that with (Anorexia Nervosa's) instrumentals and melodies, it was a bit better than Cradle of Filth.
WULF: OK, but here's the thing, and here's what I challenge you on, is yeah it reminds you of being in a castle but that really fast kind of urgency and all that stuff, what does that remind you of?
GRYM KYM: That one part, or just the crazy-
WULF: The gunshot and the really fast burst of-
GRYM KYM: What did that make me think of?
WULF: Yeah, because being in a castle is one thing, with the epicness, but-
GRYM KYM: Sure, but I wasn't even saying that I was picturing a castle so much that the kind of instrumentals they were using, especially the beginning, sounded just like a castle, like your stereotypical castle-
WULF: Right, but the really fast, crazy...what does that remind you of?
GRYM KYM: Well I can tell you it didn't remind me of powdered wigs and moles and revolvers if that's what you're asking.
WULF: Well they didn't have revolvers, but (they had) the (flintlock) pistol-
WULF: Well didn't it remind you of The Man in the Iron Mask?
GRYM KYM: Well I could see that-
WULF: Come on! I haven't seen that movie in like 14 years but-
GRYM KYM: Me neither but Nathan and I tried to find it one time. We were like obsessed...we just thought of it one day and became obsessed with the idea of watching The Man in the Iron Mask.
WULF: Yeah! I want to watch that!
GRYM KYM: We could probably watch it right now.
WULF: Pirate Bay that shit. It would be like...Leonardo DiCaprio has not been in such form-
GRYM KYM: Did you hear that he's taking a break? Anyway, let's get back to the metal.
WULF: Wait, hold on.
GRYM KYM: He's taking an acting break.
WULF: Well that's a good segue into...maybe nothing...or hold on, he's taking a break? Are we going to get sued for libel here? He's taking a break?
GRYM KYM: He's taking a break from acting.
WULF: Django was just too much for him?
GRYM KYM: He said he'd done three films in the last two years and he was exhausted, but he still has to do this whole publicity tour for The Great Gatsby.
WULF: Ohhhh, what a hard life.
GRYM KYM: I know, right? And he said he wanted to travel around and save the environment. I think he's having a breakdown.
WULF: He's like, I already adopted seven kids from Africa, what more do you want from me??
GRYM KYM: He didn't though, he's a playboy.
WULF: I know, I just made that up. That was silly. I shouldn't say that. I don't mean to downplay anyone who's done that.
GRYM KYM: I hope you're not recording anymore because this has gotten off the rails.
WULF: I'm still recording.
GRYM KYM: This has gone off the rails.
WULF: OK, so Anorexia Nervosa, you think (they're) better than Cradle of Filth?
GRYM KYM: Yeah!
WULF: Better than Dimmu Borgir?
GRYM KYM: Um...I don't know.
WULF: Do you remember (them)?
GRYM KYM: Yeah I do! They're awesome!
WULF: OK, so is Anorexia Nervosa the best metal band you've ever heard in your life?
GRYM KYM: No!
WULF: Well who's better?
|Haggard- best listened to when driving to Home Depot,|
GRYM KYM: Well, I really like Haggard.
WULF: Haggard's better?
GRYM KYM: I wouldn't...well, what do you mean "better"? Better to my tastes, or which do I prefer?
WULF: Yeah, which do you prefer?
GRYM KYM: I think I'd rather drive around running errands listening to Haggard-
WULF: Because yeah, personally I'd rather listen to fucking Devourment than Megadeth.
GRYM KYM: Well, let's hear it.
WULF: OK, well, Devourment is up next.
5. "Abomination Unseen" - Devourment
WULF: OK, so we just listened to Devourment's "Unleash the Carnivores", and I think Devourment is one of the greatest death metal bands of all time. Grym Kym?
GRYM KYM: Well, I'm not a fan of death metal in general.
WULF: OK, fair enough. Do you think the best part was the intro? We listened to track 2, I think it was "Devoured by Pigs" but maybe I'm not sure.
But it was track 2 off of "Unleash the Carnivores". So whatever that song was. But you felt the best part was just the intro of that guy talking?
GRYM KYM: Yeah, that was insane, I enjoyed that clip a lot. I think that if it is real then that's fucking cool. To incorporate that into your music, I think that's awesome, I mean...I don't know, I like anything macabre and creepy and disturbing, so to think that that was an actual clip from a serial killer, like on trial or whatever else, an interview on 60 minutes, I think that's really cool! I liked it. The drums were good-
WULF: But you didn't like the cool, like, groove/slam, you couldn't just ride it?
GRYM KYM: Well, I've heard it before!
WULF: From who?
GRYM KYM: I've heard bands like that! You've made me listen to bands like that, that have that kind of beat to it. It sounds the same to me. I'm personally just not a fan. It made me listen to Brujeria or whatever. I don't know, I'm just not a fan of death metal, but I can see how they'd be good because I thought the quality was good-
WULF: Do you feel like you would like it a lot more if you were drunk at a live setting?
GRYM KYM: Oh, yeah!! But that's completely different!
WULF: So if you were drunk in a live setting would you be going crazy?
GRYM KYM: Yes! Absolutely!
WULF: You'd be like, "this is the best band of all time!!"
GRYM KYM: Well, I'm trying to have an intelligent discussion with you, and it's not working.
But nearly every metal band I would be having a really good time listening to.
GRYM KYM: Yeah, live.
WULF: So would you say (with) every metal band live, you'd just be having a ball?
GRYM KYM: Except for doom and sludge. And maybe stoner metal as well. Those are going to kind of make me bored. Lookin' around at everything.
WULF: So if you were stoned at a stoner metal show you'd be bored, but if you were stoned at a black metal show you'd be having fun?
GRYM KYM: If I were anything at a black metal show I'd be having fun.
WULF: If you were bored at a black metal show you'd be having fun?
GRYM KYM: Yep.
WULF: Alright! Well it's like 4:30 in the morning so...Grym Kym, any last words?
GRYM KYM: Um...no.
WULF: OK, so we're doing this next week?
GRYM KYM: Yep.
WULF: Alright, Wulf (and Grym Kym) signing off.